Posts by joey jojo

405

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

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colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

joey jojo

aqwsed12345 and Sea Breeze,

You write your replies in a way that makes it seem like the trinitarian belief was a foregone conclusion in early christianity.

It wasnt. There is no specific, defined trinity doctrine that originated from Jesus. This is undisputed fact.

Belief in the trinity leans heavily on John, written late and containing a different type of gospel than the other 3 - that doesnt concern you?

It is hardly surprising that Ignatius, Polycarp, Hippolytus and Ireaneus, all followers of John are mentioned. They essentially are part of the 'school of John'.

Personally, I dont care, I just find the debate interesting from a historical point of view. I am always astonished how some people feel that a 'belief' that was agreed upon by men nearly 2000 years ago is the best we could come up with and it doesnt need any clarifications and to question it today indicates gross heresy. There arent a lot of other beliefs that have withstood the test of time since then, why is faith different?

To me its as ridiculous as arguing whether Zeus or Mars wore white or red robes.

405

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

joey jojo

aqwsed12345
The wisdom that "orders all things gently" did not permit the great mystery to blaze forth fully at once. The "sun" of this truth, at the moment of its rising, was not allowed to reach its zenith immediately, dazzling and intimidating all with its brightness. Instead, its early rays, filtering through the clouds of restraint, needed to accustom souls gradually, preparing them step by step to receive the full understanding of the mystery.

These are essentially the same words that the GB uses when they make stuff up too.

405

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

joey jojo

aqwsed - Im not an expert on this subject but your responses are clear manifestations of your faith. Faith does not require proof- just belief.

This subject has been argued for and against. There is no clear, undeniable proof that jesus is god- equal to the father and if it was true, there should be absolutely no doubt about the subject. Jesus himself would have made it crystal clear. But he didnt.

I say this with respect, this subject is a matter of faith.

405

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

joey jojo

peacefulpete
joey...The Gospel of John, counter to the order of writing, may in fact represent a branch of Christianity more primitive than the other Gospels. Sure, much of the narrative is derived from the Synoptics yet it also relies upon sources independent from that

I dont know a lot about this stuff, although it is very interesting. From what Ive read, logos,as used by the Greeks speaks about an abstract idea that involved the way god created the universe. The gospel of john attaches a distinct identity to this, which is actually a radical change.

John seems to take an idea and develop it, weaving it into the jesus story. It seems like there is more to it than simply an honest re-telling of events about jesus.

405

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

joey jojo

John is the gospel that differs from the other three with respect to the amount of interest it has in the nature of jesus and his relationship with god. John was also the last gospel written (around 100 ce). That means that John may have been written up to 30 years after the others.

The differences in style and the late date should arouse suspicions. John is the most quoted book in relation to the trinity and the father/son nature of jesus. It may reflect a bias toward a teaching or movement that started after the first 3 gospels were written.

This is a known, debated historical fact. It isnt just me saying it. If you are heavily relying on one book, John, above all others to 'prove' a trinity, then, are you being honest with yourself? It definitely raises questions if John has such a point of difference to the other 3 books. Why dont the other 3 gospels address this extremely important topic like John does? Something fishy going on here.

John reads like it is making statements of faith and taking liberties rather than documenting events like the first 3 gospels.

28

Norway didn't fall for it

by Jalisco in

la norvegia non è caduta nella trappola della torre di guardia di agosto.. https://files.accessjw.org/s/sdzfgcgk4bi48jb.

joey jojo

Wow- the tie cannot be a coincidence can it???

I dont usually get into the 'subliminal messages' theory too much but I had to double-take on this one.

Going to be interesting to see what they will do next. Will they actually make meaningful changes to disfellowshipping? How much does it mean to them to lose the funding?

5

The Last will not be as bad you think

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/4sxc3gncea8?si=lrs70jrmduogxlwn.

hi guys today im considering the second part from david schafer's recent talk, where he goes through a few prophetic signs of the end and the most up to date understanding of the watchtower, i did cover on my last video the most up to date understanding on the "hailstone message" please go back and watch it and today im considering this very dangerous understanding the watchtower has developed recently that things can not get any worse.

of course, that's what happens when you isolate yourself as leadership from the daily struggle of your membership and you live carefree life in leafy upstate new york eirh everything paid for.

joey jojo

Good point. Is it a great tribulation like the world has never seen- or will most not notice because everything is normal?

Its amazing how god constantly keeps us guessing.

6

Scam Marketing !

by Phizzy in

we are constantly being attacked by scam marketers who create a perceived need , not a real one, and hence create within us a want.

if we fill our desire for that thing or things by buying in to it, we then end up with totally unnecessary expense.

we have been scammed.. whether that be something to do with the latest fashions and trends, the latest 'phone, car or something similar.. the longest running, and most lucrative marketing scam in all human history has been religion.

joey jojo

A major part of marketing is segmentation. Instead of a shotgun approach and trying to be all things to everyone, marketing companies realised during the 20th century that it was smarter to figure out exactly what type of person would like the particular product and focus on them. Any extras they can pick up is a bonus.

Under the umbrella of Christian, there are many segments of Christian religions, mostly similar but different products. Just like Mercedes makes different model cars that appeal to different people. All made by Mercedes but suited for different purposes.

The WT probably worked out many years ago that their brand isn't for everyone, but that's ok, as long as they focus on the ones they have and capture their children too.

This is exactly what companies do. Someone like Lego brands themselves as a cradle to the grave company, that is Lego is used by consumers from babies to old age. Loyalty to football teams is passed from parents to children. The list goes on.

13

What would it like to see

by JohnR1975 in

what i would like to see and maybe will get there in about another ten years is being a jw is a rewarding thing that enriches your life.. just like other religions out there you may not know the entire truth and maybe not quite right many of the beliefs but to have to idea of a belief centres and stabilises you.. i would like jws to be able to celebrate birthdays and maybe even other holidays if they choose to and not be judged by those who choose not to.. i would like jws to be allowed to have different interpretations of scripture and everyone is happy to agree to disagree and be able to say to each other yes maybe that interpretation is nearer the truth.

we just don’t know.. i would like new members of the gb to issue an apology for previous members getting so many things wrong.. they need to come out and say they were wrong about 1914 this date has no scriptural significance and the same is true of 1919. jws were not chosen in 1919 as the one and only true religion.. we just don’t know about so many things and it takes humility to admit we were wrong.. i would like to see even more lightening up on stupid restrictions like young people being allowed to have a varied friends and activities that are not with jws only..

joey jojo

JohnR1975
most don’t believe 1914 doctrinal teachings

And yet, they will shun you if you admit to not believing it..

7

Beard quote from WT 1975

by joey jojo in

extreme hair styles can easily lead one into a trap of the devil also, and cause others to stumble.

for example, a young man in the united states was making fine progress in his study of the bible, and he was moved to share with an experienced witness in preaching to others about the good things he was learning from the bible.

from early youth he had let his beard grow, and since some in the business community wore beards, he felt that his wearing one in preaching to others would be acceptable generally.

joey jojo

Extreme hair styles can easily lead one into a trap of the Devil also, and cause others to stumble. For example, a young man in the United States was making fine progress in his study of the Bible, and he was moved to share with an experienced Witness in preaching to others about the good things he was learning from the Bible. From early youth he had let his beard grow, and since some in the business community wore beards, he felt that his wearing one in preaching to others would be acceptable generally. But in speaking to a lady he was unable to do more than introduce himself, when she said: “I’m sorry, young man, I do not want to become involved in student revolt.” No amount of explanation after this sufficed to clear up the misimpression. After the conversation ended with the closing of the door, he asked the experienced Witness what had happened. He was invited to consider his appearance in relation to what he claimed to be, a servant of God. Not wanting to be responsible for even one person’s being stumbled so as to miss the way to everlasting life, this new Kingdom publisher shaved off his beard.

w75 8/15 pp. 499-504

Yes, having a beard once meant you could be responsible for someones eternal death.